Rule 755

Let’s play “Ok/Not Ok”

Investing in an opportunity you heard about interpreting.

Not ok.

Learning CPR while interpreting for a Red Cross course and later performing CPR on a person having a heart attack.

That is Ok.

You see the obvious difference, right?

Rule 753

Stuff Uncle Dale Always Says, Explained:

Don’t be so easily impressed, I picked this video.

I have used this video to teach this principle for over 14 years. So, if I sound good interpreting it from ASL to Spoken Hearing, hint, I’ve seen it before…

However, that doesn’t mean I’m perfect. Back in the mid-1990s I helped collect videos of native Deaf ASL users telling stories and jokes for an ASL preservation library. I use some of the videos I collected in my classes to this day.

One of the stories is a man telling the Deaf King Kong joke. Remember I filmed this man telling this joke myself. I saw it live while it was recorded and have watched and used the video literally hundreds of times over the years since the day I collected it.

In 2017 a student in ASL to Spoken English suddenly said that the woman Deaf King Kong took up the building with him was named Jennifer. I dinged her for an addition error. She challenged me and… HOLY COW she was right! King Kong does say her name is Jennifer!

Not once, from the day I collected the video to that day, despite literally hundreds of viewings, had I ever noticed that detail. “A” for the day for that student!

Rule 752

Stuff Uncle Dale Always Says, Explained:

You are looking for underwear in your sock drawer, no matter how many times you dig through it you will only find socks. Time to look in other drawers.

When a student keeps making the same error over and over because they are stuck in the same habits instead of incorporating the new skill being taught.

Rule 751

Elementary School Interpreters are real interpreters.

VRS Interpreters are real interpreters.

Legal Interpreters are real interpreters.

CDIs are real interpreters.

Middle School Interpreters are real interpreters.

VRI Interpreters are real interpreters

Freelance Interpreters are real interpreters

University Interpreters are real interpreters

Pre-K Interpreters are real interpreters.

Mental Health Interpreters are real interpreters.

High School Interpreters are real interpreters.

Rule 750

When the phone rings at 1am and you know you are working a 8am, kiss your significant other and your bed goodbye, tell them both how much you will miss them, and remind yourself that you are doing a job you love and you will see both of them again… eventually.

Note From Uncle Dale: The Rhythm Trap.

This Note has become a bit of an full time job for me. I have not been able to post anything because of my obsession with it.


In the book The Hitchhikers Guide To The Galaxy (read the books. The movies don’t do the story justice!explains that the problem with time travel is not what you would expect it to be. The Guide says:

One of the major problems encountered in time travel is not that of becoming your own father or mother. There is no problem in becoming your own father or mother that a broad-minded and well-adjusted family can’t cope with. There is no problem with changing the course of history—the course of history does not change because it all fits together like a jigsaw. All the important changes have happened before the things they were supposed to change and it all sorts itself out in the end. 

The major problem is simply one of grammar, and the main work to consult in this matter is Dr. Dan Streetmentioner’s Time Traveler’s Handbook of 1001 Tense Formations. It will tell you, for instance, how to describe something that was about to happen to you in the past before you avoided it by time-jumping forward two days in order to avoid it. The event will be descibed differently according to whether you are talking about it from the standpoint of your own natural time, from a time in the further future, or a time in the further past and is futher complicated by the possibility of conducting conversations while you are actually traveling from one time to another with the intention of becoming your own mother or father.

Most readers get as far as the Future Semiconditionally Modified Subinverted Plagal Past Subjunctive Intentional before giving up; and in fact in later aditions of the book all pages beyond this point have been left blank to save on printing costs.

The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy skips lightly over this tangle of academic abstraction, pausing only to note that the term “Future Perfect” has been abandoned since it was discovered not to be.

Douglas Adams

As with most things in life the Guide gives us insight into the condition of being human-in this instance that the things that are problems are often vastly different (and a little more pedestrian) than the things we assume to be problems.

So it is with interpreting. When we struggle with an interpretation we often look for a much bigger, much more catastrophic reason for our frustration than, we eventually find out, is the ACTUAL, reason for our frustration.

For example. When working from ASL to Spoken English (and almost as often Spoken English to ASL) interpreters who are struggling tend to jump on any idea that incorporates a fatally flawed lack of skill, comprehension, or ability on their own part.

While this approach carries with it metric tons of self-deprecating, unhelpful reasoning it is also infused with two “benefits” for the interpreter’s tortured soul.

First, it’s “analysis-proof.”

In law there’s a concept called being “judgment proof.” It means if you sue me for $100 million and win, but if I don’t have a bank account or a car or a house or any real property worth any value or insurance, then it really doesn’t matter if you sue me for $10, $20 or $30 million-you’re never going to see a dime; because I just don’t have it and there is no way I ever will.

The idea of being “Analysis-proof” follows similar logic. You can give me feedback or mentoring or instruction or support all you want, but if the problem is a fatal flaw inside of me, meaning my interpreter account is empty, then no amount of analysis will EVER result improved performance.

This dovetails into the second “benefit” or what I called the “why bother” mindset.

This second issue, the “why bother” mindset, logically and commonly-but not ubiquitously-follows on the heels of being “analysis-proof” (but it can exist independently as a stand alone self-defeating self-view).

It mentally flows like this:

If the issues that I have to overcome are so vast or too much or feel like they stem from a fundamental flaw inside of me, maybe I have an underdeveloped interpreter gene, then no amount of work will ever help me get better, so why should I bother putting more effort into building my skills beyond where they are right now. Perhaps I should just be happy with what I have and not try to challenge myself.

That self-view is attractive to the tired and frustrated because it can be applied to so many areas of our lives that we see as too hard to deal with.

If you are reading this and feel like it speaks directly to you (“is Uncle Dale watching me?”*) you are not alone. Every interpreter feels these frustrations at one time or another and grabs at these “answers”.

However, like time travel, when we feel like we’ve hit these walls it is often a result of looking well beyond the mark, at huge seemingly unsolvable issues (becoming your own parent) instead of stepping back and looking for the actual issue, because the actual issue seems so simple it’s almost silly (grammar).

In my experience for example what many interpreters see as an unresolvable issue turns out to be a simple Rhythm Trap.

The Rhythm Trap

Hearing interpreters, have you ever walked passed a room and heard a voice drifting from inside and thought to yourself, “that is an interpreter working from ASL to Spoken English (or if you are one of my students, “that is an interpreter working from Deaf to Hearing” Grin)?

You know the sound. Maybe you can hear it in your head right now.

Like some kind of interpreter 12 Step Program hearing interpreters all should all be able to admit in public that some version of the words, “like butter on a bald monkey” have spilled unbidden out of our mouths.

We have all, at some strange moment, realized we were humming along to a song in our heads to the beat of word-sign-word-sign-word-sign…

Deaf Community?


You know this obnoxious interpretive dance move, you’ve seen it over and over.

Why do we do that? What’s wrong with us?

It’s not about skill. It’s not about ability. Most importantly it’s not a fundamental catastrophic flaw in you.

It’s a conflict in the differential rhythms of the source and target languages.

Seriously. It’s usually just an issue of rhythm.

Think of it like this, the human brain loves patterns. It seeks them out.

I have found many different competing theories for why this is so, from it being a genetically coded survival trait requiring our brains to reduce anything deemed necessary to live to a set of simple, easily repeated steps (I was tempted to get into Necessity Breeds Simplicity here, then I remembered, I already did that!

So, your brain loves patterns. But, as with most languages, the rhythm structures of ASL and English are not even close to each other. Think of a person from India who learned English as a second language. Their use of English words are often impeccable but native English speakers may have a hard time following their speech patterns at first because they put the English words in the rhythm of their native language; to us it’s too fast and the intonation is too subtle. This is a difference between the rhythms of the two languages.

Now look at a native user of ASL:

Not even close the the rhythm of spoken English.

This is not the first time I’ve discussed this fact. It goes all the way back to the beginning. Rule 5 to be exact:

So, as a hearing interpreter your brain sees ASL, recognizes it as a language you understand, knows at a subconscious level that it’s not the rhythm of spoken English you are comfortable with-so your brain forces it into a pattern it likes; 4/4 Time with a back beat (think of the Beatles).

Voila, that weird interpreter cadence we all recognize is born. That cadence becomes the central thing upon which your brain attaches its focus. If the cadence is compromised by a concept that cannot be produced accurately within the comfortable cadence confusion ensues.

Not actual confusion as in the interpreter doesn’t understand the meaning. Confusion as in the meaning the interpreter understands does not fit in the rhythm that the interpreter’s brain has established. The rhythmic conflict causes the interpreter to second guess their understanding instead of seeing the flaw as a result their processing and production.

“Good to know,” you say. “What do I do about it?”

Ah. That’s the fun part.

Start with prosody.

Figure out how the person for whom you are interpreting “makes themselves understood.” How do they show the beginning of an idea and the end of an idea. Figure out how they separate concepts that should be separated and connect propositions that must be connected. That is ALWAYS the first step.

Once you’ve got their discourse down, summarize in your head what happens in-between the beginning of an idea and the end of that idea. Then do the same with the next and the next…

A true summary is what you’d get if you threw the concept in a pot and boiled it down for 8 days.

The essence of the concept without the frills.

If you produced nothing but this idea the Client would have the required information (but none of it will be pretty).

Got it?

Now apply Uncle Dale’s Model of Interpreting to your summary.

Understand it in language A, say it in language B.

The Uncle Dale Model of Interpreting.

If you are working from ASL to Spoken English then understand it in Deaf and say it in Hearing.

If you are working from Spoken English to ASL the understand it in Hearing and say it in Deaf.

As needed apply the tool I gave you in the Note about necessity breeding simplicity I posted above.

If you pay attention to the meaning and not the form you can escape the Rhythm Trap.

Seems so simple.

For many of us it seems too simple.

That’s the problem. Big, insurmountable issues are often mentally and emotionally easier to deal with. If they are to big to fix we don’t need to try to fix them and we can tell ourselves to just be happy where we are.


Big, insurmountable issues are rare.

Most of the time we look well beyond the actual issue because we believe the problem that has caused us so much frustration can’t be that simple.

But quite often, it is.

Let’s be honest. Simple solutions beg to be implemented. If the issue CAN be addressed we are honor bound to try to fix it. That means we have to practice. We HAVE to put the work in.


Maybe, we think, it would be better if there was just a flaw inside of us that we can’t fix because, well, that seems easier, less labor intensive.

Here is the most important part. Pay attention. Ready?

You can do this.

There is nothing “wrong” with your brain or your abilities. The issue is nothing that a well adjusted interpreter can’t work through.

It’s all just a matter of seeing the steps you need to take and then taking them.

You’ll be fine. Just work the process.


*I’m not.

Rule 748

Solid truth at a panel discussion in my class.

Question: Do you like interpreters?

Deaf Consumer’s Answer: I generally I like all the interpreters I work with.

Q: Do you trust interpreters?

DCA: (grin) Which interpreter?

Rule 746

Interpreters sometimes get stuck in moments of error.

They set up a little research camp in that moment, and stay to more fully examine the mistake.

Sooner or later it requires permanent mental structures to house all the energy needed to roll the mistake over and over in your mind.

All the while the text has moved on and suddenly the interpreter realizes they are well and truly lost.

So they run after the text.

But don’t worry. They come back to the mistake on vacation, at about two-thirty the next morning, wide awake, in their bed.

But you don’t need to. Just remember this simple Rule:

If you’ve learned from a mistake you don’t need to dwell on it.